"Lets assume its true and the majority are supportive of the violence. Do YOU think that is the REAL face of Islam?"
I think that my understanding of religions is fundamentally different from a Muslim understanding. I view religions as cultural phenomena, as human inventions, not as truths that are handed down from on high. As such, I think religions are what we make of them. On some fundamental level, Islam is defined by the religious practices and beliefs of Muslims. In contrast, every Muslim I talk to here differentiates between ISLAM, by which they mean the ideal of what Islam should be, and MUSLIM PRACTICE, by which they mean what Muslims actually do.
On the one hand, this is a useful distinction to make. It's the reason that Huston Smith, in his landmark comparative religions textbook, discusses only the ideals of the world religions, and not the practices that sometimes belay those ideals. And this makes sense. The presence of religious wars shows that people are often pretty terrible about applying their religious beliefs, and are susceptible to employing violence despite those beliefs. That is not always the religion's fault -- it would sure seem unfair to blame the Buddha for Buddhist violence in Sri Lanka, for example. So from that perspective, it's conceivable to imagine a world in which every Muslim was violent and immoral, and yet Islam was still a good religion. (Just like Christianity is still a good religion despite the Crusades and other morally objectionable interludes in Christian history.)
However, I don't think the situation is really as clear-cut as that. Because, again, I think that religions are cultural constructs (created in response to to experiences of the Divine) and not handed down by God personally. As human creations, they are what we make of them. Imagine I invented a religion and said that it would make the practitioner more compassionate. Yet everyone who adopted my religion, in practice, became really mean and argumentative. Do you think it would be fair for me to say, "It's not my religion's fault; we value compassion"? That doesn't work. I can't define the religion in complete isolation from the way it's practiced and from the way it affects people in the real world.
So if many Muslims supported an extreme response, does that support become the real face of Islam? I don't think there's an easy answer. On the one hand, it's quite likely that those Muslims were misguided and not interpreting Islam correctly. On the other hand, I think it's useful to wonder whether there are aspects of Islam that condoned and encouraged the extreme response.
Again, I only bring this up BECAUSE Ridley said that the Muslim world's reaction was the ideal one. If the extreme reactions were in violation to the ideals and principles of Islam, then I would not hold Islam responsible at all -- any more than I hold Buddhism responsible for the civil war in Sri Lanka. However, this reaction is being explicitly lifted up as being in accordance with -- even a shining example of -- Muslim ideals. And that worries me a great deal.
Thank you for reminding me that I value compassion and understanding. For some reason I have a very short temper when it comes to the cartoon controversy. :-(
Re: Hi again
I think that my understanding of religions is fundamentally different from a Muslim understanding. I view religions as cultural phenomena, as human inventions, not as truths that are handed down from on high. As such, I think religions are what we make of them. On some fundamental level, Islam is defined by the religious practices and beliefs of Muslims. In contrast, every Muslim I talk to here differentiates between ISLAM, by which they mean the ideal of what Islam should be, and MUSLIM PRACTICE, by which they mean what Muslims actually do.
On the one hand, this is a useful distinction to make. It's the reason that Huston Smith, in his landmark comparative religions textbook, discusses only the ideals of the world religions, and not the practices that sometimes belay those ideals. And this makes sense. The presence of religious wars shows that people are often pretty terrible about applying their religious beliefs, and are susceptible to employing violence despite those beliefs. That is not always the religion's fault -- it would sure seem unfair to blame the Buddha for Buddhist violence in Sri Lanka, for example. So from that perspective, it's conceivable to imagine a world in which every Muslim was violent and immoral, and yet Islam was still a good religion. (Just like Christianity is still a good religion despite the Crusades and other morally objectionable interludes in Christian history.)
However, I don't think the situation is really as clear-cut as that. Because, again, I think that religions are cultural constructs (created in response to to experiences of the Divine) and not handed down by God personally. As human creations, they are what we make of them. Imagine I invented a religion and said that it would make the practitioner more compassionate. Yet everyone who adopted my religion, in practice, became really mean and argumentative. Do you think it would be fair for me to say, "It's not my religion's fault; we value compassion"? That doesn't work. I can't define the religion in complete isolation from the way it's practiced and from the way it affects people in the real world.
So if many Muslims supported an extreme response, does that support become the real face of Islam? I don't think there's an easy answer. On the one hand, it's quite likely that those Muslims were misguided and not interpreting Islam correctly. On the other hand, I think it's useful to wonder whether there are aspects of Islam that condoned and encouraged the extreme response.
Again, I only bring this up BECAUSE Ridley said that the Muslim world's reaction was the ideal one. If the extreme reactions were in violation to the ideals and principles of Islam, then I would not hold Islam responsible at all -- any more than I hold Buddhism responsible for the civil war in Sri Lanka. However, this reaction is being explicitly lifted up as being in accordance with -- even a shining example of -- Muslim ideals. And that worries me a great deal.
Thank you for reminding me that I value compassion and understanding. For some reason I have a very short temper when it comes to the cartoon controversy. :-(